SHOW NOTES

Welcome back to the Passive Mobile Home Park Investing Podcast, hosted by Andrew Keel. In this episode of the Passive Mobile Home Park Investing Podcast our host Andrew Keel interviews a very special guest in Joe Fairless of the Best Ever Real Estate brand.

Joe Fairless is the Co-founder of Ashcroft Capital with over $2.7 billion of assets under management. He is also the author of the Best Ever Apartment Syndication Book, creator of the Best Ever Real Estate Show podcast, and he personally has completed over 120+ Limited partner investments.

In today’s episode, Andrew Keel and Joe Fairless dive into Joe’s impressive journey of managing a real estate portfolio worth over $2.7 billion. They discuss passive versus active investing, effective portfolio tracking, and highlight the importance of staying informed on market trends.

Andrew and Joe explore a potential game-changer in the real estate market: a looming undersupply of Multi-family and Apartment housing that could lead to a significant housing crisis within the next 12-24 months. They also discuss how investors can strategically navigate and capitalize on this anticipated shift, particularly in the mobile home park sector.

Joe shares insider tactics for securing lucrative mobile home park deals, also reviews how he as a Limited Partners (LP’s) looks at capital calls for passive real estate investments, and provides expert tips on vetting General Partners (GP’s).

Tune in now to gain valuable insights and actionable strategies to thrive in the evolving mobile home park investing game with Andrew Keel and Joe Fairless!

***Andrew Keel and Keel Team Real Estate Investments (Keel Team, LLC) do not endorse any interviewee. This interview is for informational purposes only and should not be depended upon for investment purposes. ***

Andrew Keel is the owner of Keel Team, LLC, a Top 100 Owner of Manufactured Housing Communities with over 3,000 lots under management. His team currently manages over 40 manufactured housing communities across more than 10 states. His expertise is in turning around under-managed manufactured housing communities by utilizing proven systems to maximize the occupancy while reducing operating costs. He specializes in bringing in homes to fill vacant lots, implementing utility bill back programs, and improving overall management and operating efficiencies, all of which significantly boost the asset value and net operating income of the communities. Check out KeelTeam.com to learn more.

Andrew has been featured on some of the Top Podcasts in the manufactured housing space, click here to listen to his most recent interviews:  https://www.keelteam.com/podcast-links. In order to successfully implement his management strategy, Andrew’s team usually moves on location during the first several months of ownership. Find out more about Andrew’s story at AndrewKeel.com.

Book a 1 on 1 consultation with Andrew Keel to discuss:

• A deal review
• Due diligence questions
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• Mistakes to avoid, and more!

Click Here: https://intro.co/AndrewKeel

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Would you like to see value-add mobile home park projects in progress? If so, follow us on Instagram: @passivemhpinvesting for photos and awesome videos from our recent mobile home park acquisitions.

Talking Points:

00:21 – Welcome to the Passive Mobile Home Park Investing Podcast

01:27 – Joe Fairless’s journey to managing a real estate portfolio of over $2.7 billion

06:30 – Passive (mobile home park) investing versus actively (mobile home park) investing

09:13 – Tracking your (mobile home park) investment portfolio and following trends in the market

13:35 – Joe Fairless current limited partner (LP) investments including mobile home park deals

15:53 – The importance of deploying the right business model to achieve investment success.

19:00 – Current supply and demand within the housing industry and how investors can capitalize on this anticipated shift in the mobile home park sector

25:40 – A possible housing crisis in the next year

27:56 – The critical role of Limited Partners (LP’s) and how to view capital calls for mobile home park and apartment investments

30:43 – Joe’s tips for vetting a general partner and mobile home park operator

33:06 – Reaching out to Joe Fairless

34:20 – Learn like you’ll live forever

34:49 – Conclusion

SUBSCRIBE TO PASSIVE MOBILE HOME PARK INVESTING PODCAST YOUTUBE CHANNEL https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCy9uI3KGQmFgABsr9lUtRTQ

Links & Mentions from This Episode:

Ashcroft Capital: https://ashcroftcapital.com/

Keel Team’s official website: https://www.keelteam.com/ 

Andrew Keel’s official website: https://www.andrewkeel.com/  

Andrew Keel LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewkeel 

Andrew Keel Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/PassiveMHPinvestingPodcast

Andrew Keel Instagram page: https://www.instagram.com/passivemhpinvesting/

Twitter: @MHPinvestors

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TRANSCRIPT

Welcome to the Passive Mobile Home Park Investing podcast. With your host, Andrew Keel. This is the podcast where you can get the education you need to invest 100% passively in a highly profitable niche of mobile home parks.

 Andrew: Welcome to the Passive Mobile Home Park Investing Podcast. This is your host, Andrew Keel. Today we have a super special guest on the show, creator of the Best Ever Real Estate Show podcast and co-founder of Ashcroft Capital, Mr. Joe Fairless. 

Before we dive in, I want to cut a deal with you. If you get more than $500 worth of value out of this show, will you please head over to wherever you listen to your podcasts at and leave a review? It should take 10 seconds or less, and these keep me motivated to keep recording. All right, let’s dive in.

Joe Fairless is the co-founder of Ashcroft Capital with over $2.7 billion of assets under management. He is also the author of the Best Ever Apartment Syndication book, and Joe himself has completed over 120 limited partner investments. Joe, welcome to the show. 

Joe: Hey. I’m grateful to be here and looking forward to our conversation. 

Andrew: Me as well, brother. Would you mind starting out by telling our listeners a little about your story and how you ultimately came to managing a real estate portfolio of over $2.7 billion? 

Joe: I started with a $30,000 salary and $15,000 in student loan debt. I graduated from Texas Tech and moved straight to New York City. My job was a junior project manager at an advertising agency, and I was making $30,000 every two weeks. I’d get a check for about $750. Needless to say, I wasn’t able to save much actually any. In fact, I was negative out of the gate, but I climbed the corporate ladder relatively quickly.

I kept my living expenses pretty darn low, especially for New York City standards. Nine out of the 10 years, I had a roommate. It was a roommate from Craigslist, usually, so that’s always interesting. Lots of irrelevant stories that I could share that I won’t share in this podcast, but good stories to have a beer and talk about. 

I ended up climbing the corporate ladder relatively quickly and peaked as the youngest VP of a New York City advertising agency. I was making a $150,000 base salary. From $30,000 to $150,000 in a relatively short period of time. I think it was about, about seven years or so. I realized that I wasn’t fulfilled by what I was doing. 

Along the way, in 2009, four years after I graduated college, I bought my first house as an investment property. I was in New York City and I was renting. It was a tiny little apartment, two bedroom. My friends would make fun of me because I was living like a college kid, and they were upgrading to studio apartments or one bedroom apartments. I was just sticking with my two bedroom with no living room, tiny little bathroom, dorm style fridge, no windows in one of the bedrooms, no central AC. I take a washcloth, and I put it in the little freezer compartment of the dorm style fridge.

At night, right before I went to bed, I’d put it on my forehead and cool myself down during the summer. I’d wake up in the night sweaty because it was no longer cold. It was wet and warm, and then I’d swap it out in the middle of the night with a different washcloth. That’s how I was rolling.

My friends would make fun of me, but you know what, I was saving my money that I was making. I would do manning, not nannying, but manning on the side. On the weekends, I would work with kids, essentially babysit on the weekends. I was saving my money, and I saved up enough $20,000, in fact, to buy my first house, even though I was still renting. I did that four times, actually. I bought four homes and my friends were saying, how are you able to do this? 

Because of that, I taught a class on how to do it. One of my former bosses at the time attended the class. He said, well, this makes sense, but I don’t want to do any of this. House investing myself, too much work. If you ever do something larger where I can invest with you, let me know. I heard that from a couple of people.

I then realized that I had customers before I had a product. I realized I had investors who wanted to invest with me before I had the actual property to invest in. Simultaneously with the single family homes,  on my spreadsheet, I was a spreadsheet thousandaire. It was great, but in reality, I was about breaking even. I’d make $250 a month in my spreadsheet, but then someone would move out, and that’d be $3000-$4000 to get it moving ready. I realized that I needed to do something that was a little more scalable for a significant monthly cash flow impact, and that’s when I started looking at apartments. 

Andrew: Wow. What year did you start looking at apartments and end up doing your first deal?

Joe: 2012 is when I really started studying. Summer of 2013 is when we, meaning me plus 12 investors, plus a broker who put their commission into the deal, did our first deal. 

Andrew: Wow, that’s fantastic. Today in 2024, a little over 10 years, in the billions of asset under management. That is just quite a success story, so kudos to you. Let me ask you this, Joe. What do you think is the toughest hurdle that most people need to overcome in order to start passive investing in CRE syndications? Talking to that passive investor out there that maybe like you, had a W-2, has $20,000-$100,000 saved up, is thinking about buying that single family rental, but maybe it doesn’t want to be a landlord. What’s that hurdle that they need to overcome to invest passively in a bigger deal?

Joe: I would say that the realization that the profits and tax advantages can be similar to actively investing. Passive investing, profits, and tax advantages can be similar to actively investing from a return standpoint.  There’s no doubt that passive investing from a time standpoint is much more efficient than active investing.

Generally speaking, if you have similar returns financially, but you have disproportionately better returns from a time standpoint, I think we got the winner. Passive investing isn’t for everyone. I am an active and passive investor. If you’re truly looking to build your own empire, then active investing is the way to go. It takes time, it takes more risk, and it takes a more resolve and entrepreneurial grit to do it.

It has the potential to make you a lot more money. However, generally, you can make similar returns passively. But if you do really well actively, yeah, you can make a lot more, but if you look side by side, man, if you factor in the time, then passive is the way to go. That’s why I’m both. I have obviously a business. We buy value-add apartment communities actively, but I’m also a passive investor in 123 deals right now. 

Andrew: Wow, 123 passive investments. I have so many questions on that. Where do we even start? How do you track all of that? It would probably be my first question.

Joe: In a spreadsheet I made. That’s how it started out. Now I’ve got a like a wealth management company that tracks it and sends me a quarterly report, but I didn’t have them until a year and half ago or two years ago. 

It’s pretty simple how I track it. I track the type of commercial real estate, property type, apartments, mobile home, whatever, retail office. I track that in one column, and then another column is, who is the operator? Another column is, what’s the name of the property? Another column is, how much did I invest? Another column is, what’s the pref. Really, I look at that as far as, what’s the average annualized return that I can conservatively expect?

The tricky part there is year one and two, it’s going to be lower in projects versus three, four, and five, generally speaking. Just for simplicity, I just put the pref in there just because I think it could conservatively average to be that per year. Then I put who is the point person for K1s, so that my accountant or my right hand person, my assistant can go access that.

The tricky part with all of it is the K1s. It’s across 56 different operators, 123 investments. K1 time is not a fun time for others who have to put that together on my team. Fortunately, I don’t. Now I have a much more sophisticated report that includes that, but it shows, okay, how much money did I get in from each deal, each quarter? What operators are performing?

One other thing in my spreadsheet is the market, where the property is located. I can start seeing trends. Okay. these operators are paying, these operators are not, these markets are performing better than others. This property type, mobile home parks versus retail versus office, multifamily, et cetera.

One thing I found out is the property type isn’t as relevant. The market is not as relevant.  What’s most relevant is the operator and the business plan that they have. It’s not relevant.  For me, what I’ve found from my experience, it’s not relevant, the size of the deal.  If I invest a hundred thousand dollars, my hundred thousand doesn’t care if it’s a 20-unit apartment community or has retail office center that’s 200,000 square feet. It doesn’t care, it just cares about the returns. That’s one thing that I’ve seen.

Other passive investors look down on is, well, it’s a smaller deal. Who cares? It doesn’t matter. A return’s a return. What I found, though, is the smaller deals tend to attract operators who aren’t as seasoned, don’t have the sophisticated reporting, and are not committed to that as much as the larger deal.

Generally speaking, smaller deal equals less seasoned operator equals not as good communication and reporting. Returns could be just as good or better or worse, but it has no bearing on the size of the deal from my personal experience. I consider any type of size of deal as a passive investor. Knowing that, if it’s a smaller deal, then I’ll probably not get the reporting. I expect that I probably won’t have the communication. At the end of the day, it’s about returns.

Andrew: Totally. Wow. That was awesome. I appreciate the golden nuggets on the deal operator and the business plan. Is there any other trends that stick out to you and maybe you can touch on? I know you have some LP investments and some mobile home park deals. How have those performed? How did you find those operators and vet them to get comfortable investing with them?

Joe: I’d say mobile home parks, let me just look at my sheet. I have two, one sold, and I have another that’s in a fund. It’s a mobile home park and parking lot fund. I have two mobile home park investments, and it’s simply because of my lack of exposure from operators who have deals. That’s it. I invested.

On the one that closed that’s gone full cycle, I invested $75,000 in that one. They just sold about two months ago. It performed great. It doubled my money in maybe four years at most, but probably I think about three, three and a half years. I probably wouldn’t invest with the group again because of the communication approach and the lack of reporting.  But from a return standpoint, it was great.

Andrew: How did you find that operator?

Joe: Locally. Local meetup. I knew them and had more than acquaintance, less than friend type of relationship somewhere in that middle zone. Good people. I wasn’t a fan of the communication style or lack thereof, but glad we got the deal full cycle. I had no part in it other than putting in $75,000.The other mobile home park fund is a fund, and I couldn’t tell you how that’s doing. I haven’t paid attention to it, but I’m getting distributions. 

Andrew: That’s great. That’s awesome. Wow. Let me ask you this. What do you think are the most common mistakes that you see passive investors make? 

Joe: I would say chasing returns and not putting enough emphasis on the underlying asset, the business model that’s being deployed, and who is deploying it. As I mentioned earlier with my single family homes, on my spreadsheet, I was making $250 a month, but in reality, I was breaking even because of the movement.

By the way, I sold those deals later for a profit, which is great, but the cashflow play wasn’t there. When we’re presented deals as LPs, it can be incredibly enticing if we see on paper 20% return in five years or greater. It very well might be conservatively underwritten, but it might not be.

I’ll speak for myself. It’s my responsibility as an LP to understand what’s the track record of the operator. Here’s the thing. It’s not about what did they buy it for and what did they sell it for. That’s not the best indication of future success. By the way, no track record has ever a guarantee of future success. My compliance department will be happy I said that on this interview.

What is a good measurement to look at is, what was the NOI growth of the properties they exited from start to finish? Yes, the returns were great, but tell me about what was your average NOI growth and over what period of time, and then perhaps compare that to what are you projecting NOI growth to be on this subject property that I’m evaluating over what period of time. That is a more apples to apples approach. That removes the variable of cap rate compression, and it isolates the variable of effective execution of a business plan. 

Andrew: That’s huge. Yeah. I think for anybody listening, that is golden because if we look at the last 10 years, it was hard to mess up. There was a lot of new syndicators out there doing deals and getting lucky, right, because of cap rate compression. But now, in the last few years, which is actually a good transition, are you guys doing deals now, Joe, with Ashcroft? How are they performing? How is your current deals performing?

It’s been tough even for us. We’re a small boutique syndication firm, but it’s tougher to find deals that pencil out when interest rates are, for us, from local banks, are 7.5%-8.5%. That NOI growth is huge? What are you doing to the asset to really add value? How’s your current portfolio doing? What are passive investors seeing right now in the marketplace?

Joe: Operationally, generally, we’re doing very well. Obviously there’s a property or two that occupancies in the high 80s, and we want it in the mid 90s. NOI growth isn’t there for whatever reason. Maybe it’s the new supply that’s coming. A historic rate has hit the multifamily markets across the nation, which I’d like to touch on that in a moment, but I’ll answer your question directly. 

Operationally, fine. In some cases, really well. I was just looking at our reports earlier this morning. One property, 200 plus unit, we’re at 99.9% collections. It depends on the market, the sub market, the team on the property, on the ground. It depends on many variables.

I’d say from a capital market’s perspective with interest rates, yeah, that was a challenge. It still is. One thing that we’ve done is three of the properties and one of our funds, we’re refinancing in the fixed interest rate agency debt. The other five properties in that same fund, we’re going to sell when it becomes more opportunistic to sell, which  leads me to the under supply comment I mentioned.

I just want to mention because regardless if I recognize what your focus is, it’s not multifamily. I do want to touch on something because it is important for everyone to know. What we do with it is whatever our choice, but this will happen barring some black swan event. We’re about to experience a severe under supply of multifamily across the nation. It’s a fact. The reason why it’s a fact is because right now, we are experiencing a flood of supply of multifamily, and that’s because the interest rates were low, cheap, and projects penciled. All those projects that penciled, a couple of years ago, they’re being leased up right now, so there’s a lot of supply.

If you read the news publications, you’ll read that, hey, tons of supply. Here’s the thing. The demand is keeping pace with the supply. 94.2% is the average multifamily occupancy for the last three months nationally, obviously depends on the local market, but just to get an idea of the trend. Historic amount of supply.

I’ll tell you how it’s historic. The average  completions for multifamily in a calendar year across the nation, 217,000 a year. This year alone for the first half of the year, 284,000. Crazy. First half of the year, 284,000. The average for full calendar year, 217,000, but it’s about to drop off a cliff.

This is the greatest difference between supply coming online and starts being started since the 1970s. It’s just completely shifting from lots being built to basically nothing being built. That demand is going to continue to increase because it’s actually interesting.

The households, and this will be relevant for everyone, mobile home included, that the average amount of people within a household on the new leases of apartments has dropped about 3%. It’s the lowest since 2016. It’s because our income is outpacing the expenses, generally speaking. 

Half of the consumers in the US with a credit card, they’re still paying bills on stuff they spent last summer. Forty-seven percent of people with a credit card bill is still paying it off from stuff they spent last summer. There’s a lot of debt piling up, but even faster is the income that they’re making. That’s increasing even faster.

That’s a perfect storm for man if the music stops that that’s not going anywhere, but because those incomes are going to be trouble. Your world’s going to be even better with mobile home parks, anyone who has a property to rent, because they’re not going to be buying and can’t afford it.

You asked what we’re seeing now. We have a deal in Orlando. The absorption is out pacing the supply by 20%. We’re going to have 20% of people, it’s about 1600 projected units that are needed, that won’t be there in the submarket that we’re buying in. 

Andrew: Wow. It goes back to 2008, the Great Recession where people just stopped building new supply because everything happened. You stopped building for four or five years, you forget that that catches up to you. I think we’re still at a deficit in the millions of housing units needed. I think right now with interest rates being where they’re at and the oversupply narrative, again, people are stopping on new projects.

We’ll get the ones that penciled out a couple of years ago to come online, but then the ones that are supposed to be starting right now and penciling out are not penciling out for three to four years from now. That’s an interesting point that I think will compound into something interesting.

Furthermore, there’s all this rent regulation with rent control and some markets that are being talked about, which again is going to further cause an affordability issue. That’s where mobile home parks come in, but it’s definitely its own bucket. Compared to multifamily, it’s a very affordable product, but it can be management intensive in some of these projects. You just need, like you said earlier, a good operator that has a good management company to stay on that stuff.

Let’s pivot here real quickly and talk about the next 12-24 months. The Fed has hinted at lowering rates, but obviously who knows what’s going to happen. What would you say?If you had a crystal ball, Joe, what’s going to happen the next 12-24 months in the commercial real estate market? 

Joe: I know what’s going to happen with multifamily. I mentioned it. We’re about to experience a severe undersupply in multifamily in about 12 months. You’ll see headlines completely do a 180 from tons of supply to holy cow. There’s not nearly enough, and there’s going to be even more of a housing crisis.

As a multifamily owner, as a mobile home park owner, if you have assets, you’re going to be doing well because those assets. What happens when there’s more demand than supply and you own the thing that’s in demand? The value goes up. That’s what will happen with multifamily and supply.

Who the hell knows what’s gonna happen with interest rates? I’m not going to claim that I have an idea. Obviously I’ve read what most of us have read, 90% or so chance they’ll make the cut in September. As of this recording, who knows as of tomorrow or the next day. I’m tired of looking at what they’re projecting. Especially since at the beginning of this year, there was supposed to be four or so rate cuts, and now there might be one, maybe two, maybe zero, who knows.

I can tell you that from a fundamental standpoint, if you have restricted supply and you have increased demand, you’re going to be in a good spot. That’s why we’re buying this property in Orlando, and that’s why we’re going to continue to be optionistic with our deals. The challenge is that other operators know that this is about to happen. Therefore, there’s not a lot of deals for multifamily in particular. We’re fortunate because we have a relationship with the seller. I know them, and they need to sell because of some loan maturity things. We’re fortunate to be able to buy this at the basis that we’re buying it. 

Andrew: That’s great. Let’s talk about capital calls. When do you put up the needed capital and when do you walk away as an LP? How do you approach a cash in refinance? How should an LP look at these? This has been a hot topic recently on a lot of the forums. What would you comment on that? 

Joe: As an LP, I’ve been involved in five  capital calls. Three, I have participated in and two, I have not. The three questions I asked myself, (1) Do they have a plan? (2) Do I believe  in their ability to execute the plan? (3) Where’s my money in the capital stack if I participate? They were favorable answers for three, and the other two were not favorable answers.

One of the two ended up getting foreclosed on again. I was a limited partner. Just to make sure that’s clear, I was a limited partner on that, just along for the ride. I didn’t like it. The other deal that I didn’t participate on, I just got the email a couple of days ago.

I just don’t have faith in them because what I’ve seen from the deals that I’ve read about and people who I know, because again, I’m in 56 different operators, so I’ve seen things, when there are two things present, the deal’s in big time trouble. (1) A debt issue. (2) Operations. If you’ve got both those that are issues, that’s major trouble. If you have one, you can navigate it assuming that you’ve got the right team and the right plan. 

With that other one that I just got the email a couple of days ago. I’m in two investments with them, and I haven’t seen them hit 90% occupancy on either of the two. It’s actually low 80% occupancy, just simple value add deals. I hope things go well.

I’ve mentioned to them, hey, I’m here to help out in whatever way I can as an LP. I’m not participating because I haven’t seen you guys hit 90% occupancy on any of the deals I’m in, so I don’t have faith in your operations. If it was just a debt challenge, then I’m in. But if it’s both writings on the wall…

Andrew: That’s good insight. Thank you for that, Joe. Just a few more questions. One of those is, how can an LP best vet a GP operator before investing with them? Or  do you have any best practices?

Joe: (1) I mentioned NOI growth. (2) I would make sure they’re the owner operator. Who you’re investing with is actually the one who is responsible for making the decisions, and they have the track record and experience to be the one who makes those decisions. Those two are very black and white, but the third is more of an intangible. It works for me, but do you trust in their ability to stay focused on this and this is a priority for them?

I see some operators as more of the entrepreneur type bouncing from one thing to another, whereas I think the best ones maintain focus. What their specialty is, there are exceptions for sure, but that’s how I think about it generally. 

Andrew: Yeah, that’s a very good point. Even myself, mobile home parks was our thing. Back in 2021, we’re like, oh, everybody’s on this storage train, let’s try it out. Got in there and it’s a completely new ball game. We should have slowed down and realized, hey, this is something new. Like you mentioned earlier, it’s very market driven, sub market driven.

Most of them did well, but some of them, we were lucky to just get the capital we invested out of it. You got to be careful and you got to stay focused. I like that piece right there. Joe, dude, thank you so much for doing this interview. If any of our listeners would like to get a hold of you or Ashcroft Capital, what would be the best way for them to do so? 

Joe: You can go to ashcroftcapital.com. Go to current offerings, and you can see that deal in Orlando. We’re buying five minutes from Disney. $115,000 is what the average current tenant makes at the property, 2021 construction.

It’s a value add deal, believe it or not, because the current owners been competing with three different properties that have been doing the lease up like we’re talking about earlier, or those lease ups are almost completed, so now we can do the value add, where we raised the rent to the market level without needing to do the actual construction and having the risks associated to the construction part. We’re excited about that deal. That’s how you can get to it, ashcroftcapital. com, current offerings. 

Andrew: Awesome. Thank you for that. Before we sign off, what’s one last bit of important advice you would give an interested passive investor, LP before we sign off?

Joe: What is that Gandhi quote? It’s something about, learn like you’ll live forever. Learn like you’ll live forever. Just keep listening to your podcast, Andrew, keep soaking up the info from other people who are doing what you’re doing, and learning from their experiences and sharing your experiences. 

Andrew: Awesome. Great advice, Joe. Thank you so much for coming on the show.

Joe: All right, thanks. Thanks, everyone. 

Andrew: That’s it for today, folks. Reminder, please leave us a review if you got value out of this show. Thank you so much for tuning in.

Would you like to see mobile home parks values and projects in progress? If so, follow us on Instagram @passivemhpinvesting for photos and awesome videos from our recent mobile parks acquisitions. Once again that’s @passivemhpinvesting on Instagram. See you there.